Season 2 – Episode 4: Astrology and the Tarot: Spiritual Tools for Being with Noella Downs
In this episode of the Path and Purpose podcast, I delve into a deep exploration of living from one's soul's purpose in conversation with my friend Noella Downs, a psychic reader from Santa Monica. We share insights on spirituality and leadership, and discuss the intersections between astrology and tarot. Noella recounts her spiritual journey, her 'dark night of the soul', and how it led her to tarot reading. We explore the roles these tools play in understanding our soul's journey, focusing on being rather than doing. Noella and I also touch on the importance of self-discovery and personal growth, emphasizing the significance of the journey of spiritual awakening and leading a life of authenticity. We conclude with a tarot reading, illustrating how these practices can provide insight into our lives. The episode encourages listeners to embrace spirituality with self-reliance and open-mindedness.
*The Soul Purpose Collective:
https://www.yourpathandpurpose.com/spc
*Astrology Readings:
yourpathandpurpose.com/astrologyreadings
Noella Downs Wellness:
noelladowns.com
TikTok & Instagram: @theplayfulmystic
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Discover the path to your soul's purpose athttps://www.yourpathandpurpose.com
Episode Transcript:
Cameron: Welcome to the Path and Purpose podcast, where we explore the journey of living and leading from your soul's purpose. I'm your host, Dr. Cameron Martin. As a spiritual coach and leader, I've dedicated my life to helping change makers, creatives, and conscious leaders align with their soul's calling. In each episode.
We dive deep into the stories of those who are paving the way for a more conscious and compassionate world. My purpose is to explore the intersection of spirituality and leadership, offering you practical insights and inspiration to live and lead with authenticity. Join me as we discover how to embrace our soul gifts, overcome barriers, and learn to lead from being.
This podcast will inspire you to live in alignment with your soul's purpose and create a lasting impact one conversation at a time.
On this episode of the podcast, I'm joined by my good friend, Noella Downs. Noella, originally from Nairobi, Kenya, is now based in Santa Monica, California. She is a psychic reader with over 25 years experience, a KRI certified Kundalini yoga teacher, a level two holy fire Reiki practitioner, certified personal trainee, and a And writer.
She's also quite the creator on TikTok. So I'm excited to share this conversation with you today. Noella and I met through friends and in the spiritual community here in Los Angeles. And actually this is A conversation that her and I had several months ago. Um, and we're actually even closer now. So I'm excited to share sort of 1 of our earlier conversations with you.
Um, but this conversation was really exciting because we went pretty deep. Uh, with the connections between astrology and the tarot, and Noelle is an excellent tarot card reader. I have had the good fortune of, uh, experiencing her magic and it really was quite a pleasure to have this conversation to share sort of the intersections between the two.
Now, Noella will share, uh, in the episode about, you know, her spiritual experience and in particular, her dark night of the soul that led her to using the tarot. But, uh, it was pretty cool in the episode because I shared how I view a birth chart in a similar way to how she shares It's how she uses the tarot.
The thing about astrology is that a lot of people don't understand just how deep it can go. And for most people, there is a superficial understanding of astrology. You know, your sun sign, maybe your moon, but the depth to which your chart actually says something about who you are as a being, most people are not really aware of.
In Noella describes the use of the tarot. And both systems. It's equally powerful in helping us to understand our soul's journey, uh, whereas astrology having to look at the soul's complete journey. Your lifetime and the decision points and the evolution that you're moving towards in this life. The Tarot, more about the archetypes of what we call the hero's journey.
So this journey from beginning something brand new in your life, all the way through the trials and tribulations that the Fool card moves through in order to move or experience or achieve something in life so that Tarot can be really powerful in helping us understand what this moment is. And maybe a future moment or two has in store for us.
And while I was going to share more about this with you, but honestly, I'm excited because we geeked out over astrology and the Tarot and sort of the connections between the two and how powerful they really can be in helping us to understand ourselves spiritually. And there is actually a little bit of a surprise in this session or in this conversation that I didn't expect to happen.
So happy to share it with you. Also, I wanted to make a point. Because Noelle made a really important point towards the end of our conversation that I think is worth reflecting upon. And really the idea is about our journey. We're often thinking about where we want to go, what we want to achieve, what we want to succeed.
And many times when we're thinking about our purpose, we can often think in that linear way. I must do this and this and this to live my purpose. But this paradigm of, of having to do in order to achieve isn't really what it's all about. Um, because ultimately we're here on earth to express our being, to express our soul's signature in the best way we know how.
And the tarot actually shows us through the archetypes the importance of the journey itself. Not its eventual outcome. And so Noella makes a couple of comments that I want to prepare you for because I really love them in understanding the power of the journey itself. And in particular, when we are not present in the journey or when we're looking forward, or we're trying to accomplish that actually we can forget things, or we don't leave enough time to ground experiences into our being.
And what do I mean by that? Well, you can go to a yoga retreat for a weekend, or a week long retreat like I have, I've done many of these around the world. And, if you run back into life, and forget everything, and just get back into your old ways of being, accomplishing, doing, doing, doing, you can miss what, gift was really there.
And in order to really receive everything that we can from our spiritual journeys, we've got to slow down enough. We have to slow down to receive and allow whatever frequency, whatever information, whatever activations, whatever growth we've learned within ourselves to settle into our being. And oftentimes, On many journeys, but definitely in the spiritual journey, there's a lot of this energy of, I want to heal and I want to achieve this and I want to do that.
And in reality, we do need to take time. And I think this is a super important point I want to share with you. And we need to take time in our journey to pause, to integrate, to reflect, because if we're going too fast, we might get to where we're going, but we might miss out on all of the. Juice that life has to offer.
We might miss out on the gifts, on the skills, on the abilities that we were meant to receive. And so I wanted to just leave that little nugget there for you, because I think it's something I haven't spoken about in previous episodes of the show. And it's really important. So thank you for being here. And I hope that you enjoy this episode.
I'm really excited to share this space with you today, Noella. Welcome.
Thank you. Thanks for the intro. It's very good to be here, Cam.
You're so welcome. So, this is season two of the show, and I'm trying something new this season. I'm going to start off by reading a little bit from my guest's birth chart.
So, I'm going to start, uh, that way. I won't go too crazy, but I want to share with the audience a little bit about you from your astrological birth chart. Hey, then we'll get into the story of you as you see it. Um, so when I look at your birth chart, your son is in Scorpio, you have several planets in Scorpio sun Neptune and Mercury, uh Scorpio energy is very deep below the surface very much connected to the subconscious the spiritual realm personal growth and development Um in your chart, you have the sun and Neptune conjunct one another which is next to one another Strong intuition, strong spiritual gifts.
Uh, you know, this about yourself, very creative, very artistic, very intuitive. And you definitely speak in a way that's scorpionic. What do I mean by that? Below the surface, you like having authentic, deep, connecting conversations with people. Um, probably don't have a lot of space for shallowness. It's like, I want to meet people.
I want to go deep. I want to know who you are. Let's talk about your traumas and your dramas. I'm sure we'll have a great conversation today. You also have several planets in Virgo. You have Pluto, the planet of transformation and change. Uranus, the planet of independence. Uh, and who you are as a unique individual and Jupiter, the planet of growth and Virgo is all about service.
Uh, it's a sign that it really is about, it's connected to teaching and healing about being practically of service to others. The fact that you have these heavy hitters there tells me you're definitely a healer, teacher. When you use your voice, it matters. It makes a difference in the lives of others. And when I look at sort of.
Maybe the path of your soul's journey in this life. Your north node is in Aries, so in this lifetime, you're learning many lessons of self. You're moving away from lessons in partnership, so as a person in a relationship, this sort of thing, and moving towards lessons of self, and self reliance, self acceptance.
Um, so partnership is an important theme in your life, mostly because you're moving away from perhaps old patterns, old beliefs, something there. And in this lifetime for you, Aries, initiation, creation, fire, get out there, show who you are to the world. This is an important theme, um, in your lifetime. So how's this, uh, how's this resonating?
Noella: Very like, it's very enlightening. I, it's the first time I've heard anyone read it like that. Um, and I, oh, I wanted to ask a quick question, uh, cause I gave you like a, a breath of time, uh, from four to four 30. So I was curious which time you used, or did you use that?
Cameron: So I love this. And my listeners would be like, Ooh, I don't know the time of my birth.
So actually the time that I use. To look at the chart, I'm looking at 410, but I also looked at 430. So what I didn't comment on was your ascendant sign, because if we don't know that time, only because for you, actually the time change. So at 410 in the morning, when you gave me that time, that's a Libra ascendant.
430, um, was a Scorpio ascendant.
Noella: Right. Interesting. What did, what did you see for my Venus by any chance?
Cameron: So Venus is in Libra. Yes, you definitely like to be in partnership. You are attracted to be.
Noella: Yeah.
Cameron: Attracted to others and beauty and aesthetics and things like that. But your North Node in Aries suggests to me that partnership is Being with another is an important lesson, but it's more about learning about yourself.
Noella: I completely resonate with that. I wish it wasn't true. Like, I mean, I prefer to be with someone cause it's easier and I enjoy it. But, um, I, I have figured that one out very much and very much like that was the part of the reading that I'm like, Oh my God, you know, cause it's really on. And, uh, I definitely have also been discovering the, the desire actually now to be in front of people and to.
You know, resonate, you know, sort of like vibrate that way. Where in the past when I was younger, it was, it was something I did, but it was not something I enjoyed. It was just something I had to do sort of with, with what was coming towards me. Now I I'm realizing, wow, that's really something I, I, I need to do.
And I, and I enjoy on a much greater level than I would have ever thought. I was even an actress, like in initially when I came out here, I was acting for about five years and I quit because of that. Like, I was like, no, I don't think this is me, but it was really because I was too afraid. You know, it was not about not being able to do it.
It was just the fear of being judged, the fear of what I, if I could really do it. It was, it was, I didn't have control. So I quit. But now, um, you know, with my content creation, I've really discovered a new side and that's making so much sense that it's Aries now. Cause I would never have thought that. I don't, I don't think I even knew that I had Aries in my chart.
Cameron: Well, actually, yeah, the only planet you have in your charm for Ares is Saturn, the planet of restriction, so it's actually harder and takes more effort for you to, I'll say in one way, assert your will, be an individual. You are much more comfortable in relationship. You definitely won't be around other people.
This is more of a karmic lesson.
Noella: That's what I mean. Like, it's not, it is, it is a lesson. And I struggled with that. Like I really, I was married for 15 years and, and the biggest reason was because I prefer being in partnership. And I left because I realized you need to figure out you and you need to be, um, I was always being the best wife, the best backup, the best support.
And I was like, and I did that deliberately. And then one day I just got this hit like, Nope, Nope, nope, you're hiding, you know, so yeah, I get it. Yeah.
Cameron: Well, then let's talk about this journey of you then. Cool It sounds like it resonated right off the bat. Season two y'all Yeah,
Noella: you did a fantastic job of explaining that and again I don't really understand the houses or anything, which I should by now at this point in my career But I've never been deep in astrology.
I think because it's so mathematical And I, I resist anything that has anything to do with geometry, math, or anything. So, although I should really know it, and I do, it was actually probably what got me started. My, my childhood best friend's mom was so into it. And she would read us from, uh, I think it was Linda Goodman's Sun Signs.
All the time, that and this relationships one, because we were just starting to like be puppy love and all that. So she'd be like, Oh, Scorpio says this and you should be with this kind of guy, you know, so I got into it from that. And then I remember thinking I was in Christian schools. So I thought, Oh, I guess I'm not allowed to do this.
So I completely blocked it out for a long time. And then after college, it was like, why did I stop being into that stuff? That stuff was cool, you know, so that's kind of what sort of slid me in. There was beginnings that I didn't even realize were. We're getting me into that direction.
Cameron: Yeah. Well, I also grew up, uh, Catholic, so I was in the Catholic church myself and astrology was definitely not something I was practicing at all.
And it wasn't until I actually left the church and I was sort of in this free fall spiritually, or I was like, Oh my God, I need help. And I don't know what's going on with me or really who I am right now. And that's when I found astrology and when it was useful for me, Yeah. Yeah. And to your point, there's a lot more going on inside of you than, you know, just, Ooh, your son's here.
Don't date that guy. Don't, don't go there. Right. It's way deeper. Hey there. If you enjoyed the astrology reading at the start of today's episode, imagine how insightful a personalized reading could be for you. In my one on one astrology sessions, we dive deep into your unique birth chart to uncover your soul.
Blueprint and gain clarity on your soul's journey, whether you're seeking guidance in your personal growth, exploring your soul's gifts, or wanting to understand more about your life's direction and intuitive astrology reading with me can offer you profound insights for your journey. If you're ready to discover what the stars have to say about your soul's path, head over to your path and purpose.
com slash astrology readings. To book your session today.
I'd love to know what really marked the beginning of your spiritual journey. So obviously I see you, I know you, you live, sleep, eat, well, we've met before a couple of times, but I still feel like I know you. You live, sleep, eat, breathe all of this spirituality, but where did this come from? What marked the beginning of your?
Noella: You know, it's so hard when people ask that question. It's such an interesting question now to me because I realized there's so many awakenings. That you, it's kind of hard to mark the beginning, but I know when I really awaken, like when I was like, well, this world is not what we think it is. You know, that kind of thing was when I watched the matrix the first time, I just remember watching it and just being like, oh my God.
That movie wasn't a movie. That wasn't a movie. Like, just being like, and I was telling my husband and he's just like, it was really cool. Yeah. And I was like, no, no, no, it wasn't a movie. You don't understand. You know? And he was just kind of like, yeah, it was deep. I was like, no, but you don't understand.
Like it really was about something. And I just remember just knowing like the red dress lady. I was like, Oh my God, I get it. I get it. And from then on, so that was my first like dipping into like, I got to figure this out. And then at around, but I was already doing tarot readings at that point. And I have always been into spirituality.
I mean, I grew up in a Christian school. I, so I understood Chris, like there was something beyond this, but I just always, there was a big disparity with me about like how, you know, you got from A to Z and the whole thing of like, you're going to hell and all that. I was just like, this doesn't feel good.
You know, it doesn't feel right. So when I was in college, I remember just like dropping the whole thing completely. I didn't talk about it. I just stopped. And, but then it left me with nothing. And so I was kind of free falling. Like you said, I started reading books like, um, Eckhart Tolle and. Things like that and the four agreements and I started getting into it and then I've watched the matrix and that was the first The matrix was when I started going like I really need to start to dig like yeah, I'm doing tarot cards Yeah, I'm doing this stuff But it's all just sort of like this interesting thing that I'm not quite sure why it even fit that factors in But I did know that I was always feeling like something's missing like something is just not Feeling like something about this reality does not feel solid to me, right?
So after the Matrix, I remember just started really reading voraciously then and then my real awakening was I had a huge nervous breakdown in 2014 and um and because of that I was like and I was really for me like being an addict and Not knowing what to turn to and just being like God if you're real you better show me something You know, and then, Oh, I, I went through a huge, massive breakdown.
And in that time for like a two week period, I had sort of a real like blissful period. Like I had my breakdown and I woke up and it was like, Oh, everything's lovely. And, Oh, everything's so beautiful. And I don't know what I was thinking and that, and I thought that was life now, you know? And, um, I remember I was, I was in like a horrible, like I was in Hammett, you know, which is, I don't know, a couple of hundred miles, uh, do in the desert, like inland.
And it's not the place you want to be. But I remember being like blissful, like just as if I was like, I went to some beach town and it was relaxing, you know, now it's like what, but I, when I, when I came out of that bliss state a couple of weeks later, it was like horrific because I had moved my life there.
I had, I had given everything up and I'd moved there. And I know that that happened so that I would give everything up. I know that it happened exactly the way it needed to be. But at the time it was. Outrageously horrible and I was stuck and, um, I had nowhere to go except dig deep. Now, like now the only thing that's going to save you, how am I going to get back to LA?
How am I going to get back to normalcy? How am I going to rebuild my life? I, I dropped all my clients. I quit like, what, who am I even? Right. So it was like a year of that. And then I got back and I got back my clients like right away. I was just like, wow, they still, they didn't quit on me. Like they don't, they They don't care that I had this crazy episode.
It made me more interesting in Hollywood. You know, it was like, it was wild. I remember like, I remember talking to my cousin cause she was the one who I stayed with and I said, I don't know, I don't know what I'm going to do now because she said, no, well, I trust me. Your clients will want you back immediately.
And I came home, I came back to do like a two week little period. And I just did a, like a little call out to everyone. I'm going to be in LA for two weeks. So if you want a reading, I'll be, Oh my God, I was booked for solid. For two weeks. And then one of my friends said, just live with me. Just come back and live with me.
And that was sort of me coming back in and took me years to rebuild. But from that place was what I needed because it came, I had to start from the ground and I had to believe. From a very authentic place, and I had to because I had nothing and I had nothing but faith. So from then on it was like not only I can trust that now I do have a real gift because people are literally seeking me out in this position.
But also now I'm having, I'm coming from a place of having studied for those months, you know, really studied like, what do I believe? I did 12 steps so that I could get completely clean. I did them voraciously, you know, I did them completely authentically. So I really switched how I looked at life and my capacity.
What, what was a good human being? What, what are the rules, you know, of, uh, a person that has good structures, big, good, solid foundations and beliefs. And where are your, where are the holes, you know, did my inventory the whole bit. So, um, I really got like ground training, you know, round floor training on life again.
And that really helped me from then on. So, yeah, that was. the beginning and then it's been many awakenings since then.
Cameron: Yeah. It's like you get the first or the first big one and then all of a sudden, yeah.
Noella: Yeah.
Cameron: I resonate a lot. Thank you for sharing that. I resonate a lot with what you're saying about like my first big awakening when I was in this state of bliss, oneness, samadhi, you know, they talk about all of this like Everything is one and everything is beautiful, right?
I remember when that occurred for me, I remember going to dinner that night. I was in a, I was basically in a retreat. I went to one of those make your own salad places and it was like horrible food, but I didn't care. It was the best meal of my life. Cause bliss, oneness and everything. And then, and then, and then, and then, I came out of that pretty quickly.
It wasn't even two weeks. I think it was like a couple of days before I started coming back down to earth. But that's when I recognized, Oh, I'm definitely here for a spiritual purpose. I'm definitely here to help people understand that there are different aspects of themselves. And it sounds like to me, you.
understood that within yourself, um, in that journey. I'm curious, uh, where did the tarot come from for you? How was, what was that journey like?
Noella: Um, what happened was, um, my first reading that I ever got was, um, from, uh, a tarot reader in Santa Barbara like me and my college friend went to someone in one of those neon places, you know Neon sign places on the boulevard, whatever.
So we were like snuck in there during our college You know lunch break or whatever because we're both like let's just try it. Let's just try it Nobody has to know kind of thing and we went in there. It was awful It was like like I remember both of us were like, huh? That was not all the was not what we thought we thought it was gonna be like in the movies and we're both like What did she tell you?
She said, you're going to meet some handsome guy. It was just like, it was crap. And I remember it was 40 bucks each. And that, for back then, that was quite a bit. It would have been like 120 bucks right now. But, um, I just remember thinking that was just crap. And then a few years later, I had moved to LA and I had fought very hard for some guy and he didn't like me back the same amount.
He liked me, but it wasn't going to go there. And I was just heartbroken. And I didn't know, I couldn't get over him. So I went to a tarot reader for like 30 minutes. I think two or three months, just too much. Like I went like every other week and she just raped me with her money. Like, just took my money.
Like crazy. Like, I'll just do a spell in our church for you. This is going to, I need you to bring me bread and this and that. And basically she was having me just shop for her, right? And I knew it, but I didn't care. Cause I just wanted to feel better. And she would say things that made me think like, maybe I'd get this guy back.
And then one day I remember that she said, drop by, get me some butter, some milk. And I was just like, she's giving me butter. Like, she didn't ask me just to pick up some bread on the way. So now she's asking me, like, literally for the week's shopping. And I was just like, No, I don't think I'm going to come by today.
And that was, and I was livid because, and I was livid at me. I was really livid at me. Cause I was just like, you've been doing this for weeks. Like, what are you doing? And then I called my dad. I said, I need to come home because I'm losing my mind. So I went home for the summer and I, and I learned the, how to divine do divination from the I Ching, but the I Ching doesn't do divination.
Do it that way. It's much more spiritual. It's more deep. It's more about layers. It's like what I would do now if I was like really trying to figure things out, but I wanted facts I want to know when is he coming back? Does he like me? Is there another girl like I wanted facts? So I came back to the states and I was like immediate tarot cards.
I'm gonna figure this shit out I'm not going to another person I can do it better than them So I got a deck and obsessed for three months at night and day It was just shuffling and started doing my friends and they were like, oh my god, you're really good You And then I started working at the Psychic Eye bookshop in the Valley for three years.
I worked there two and a half years, um, on and off. Like I'd worked there for a year. Then I was like, I just need to go on my own. And then I'll take off and come back. And the last time I quit, I was like, I'm really quitting. Cause my clients were like, listen, I'll come to you if you don't come here anymore.
Cause you don't want to come in here. So I did. I went on my own and I've been doing it ever since. Wow. What an amazing story. I love the Torah. I love, I'm actually writing a book on it right now. And the reason I love it is because it's a journey. It's not about the cards. It's about self discovery. It's the hero's journey.
It's, um, it's, it's really gets helps you to get to know yourself and it helps you to get to know patterns. How do people function? What is this person in this stage of their life really doing? It's a lot like astrology, but it's more specific to the moment. And so it's just really fun because, and to me, what I like about it also is it creates a conversation between, um, Whether it's you and the tarot or you and the person in front of you, it's just very creative.
It's just, it's just very creative and it's very telling and it's, it's like unraveling a story together. So to me, it's just fascinating and it's fun and it's um, it's always interesting. Like I never am like, oh, I'm so bored. I'm always like, every time I'm reading someone, it's, it's something new, even if it's somebody I read a lot, even if I think I know, there'll be things that come up.
I'm like, Oh, wow, I never looked at the card that way. That's interesting. Or the, or the, or the client will say, Oh, that's a pink bunny over there. And that probably means this. And I never thought about it like that. I never dismiss it. Cause it's like, Oh, there, I saw something I didn't even perceive that actually is a factor.
Interesting. You know, that kind of thing. Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah, it's fascinating. I mean, you just mentioned maybe the connection between astrology and the tarot. Both of these systems are archetypal, right? For me, when I say Aries, it means, oh my god, a million things. Just like when I say to you the Tower card, you know, this means a whole bunch of things to me.
It could be possible, and what I think is really interesting, especially for those who are listening and are not necessarily familiar with the modalities, right, maybe they've had a psychic reading before, maybe they've had a tarot card reading, maybe they've had an astrology reading, but they don't quite know that there are different systems that afford a different perspective.
I love what you said about, This present moment, which is really kind of the gift of the Tarot, I would think so as well. Understanding this present moment in your hero's journey is, I think, the most beautiful way of describing that. You know, it's not a crystal ball, just gonna tell you all the little things, just like I tell people.
Astrology is not a crystal ball. I don't know that tomorrow a brown dog is going to bite your foot. Like, all I know is that there might be an opportunity for an accident or something. And it really, I think these tools are the most powerful and any tools like them, but these two in particular, when we take ownership in our own lives and understand that we're co creating with the universe and that these tools are helping to mirror and show us and bring consciousness.
To our journey, right?
Noella: Absolutely. That's a great way to put it, actually. And I also think, like, what you're saying, like, about being archetypal, it helps you, like, also, like, if you want to create something to identify with certain cards or certain aspects of your chart, so that you can bring more of that into your reality.
So a lot of times when I'm doing readings, people will say, um, do you think that you telling that person is what made them go there, or do you think that that's just what you saw because it was going to happen? I'm like, I don't care. Like I don't know and I don't care because we're always creating so there's no way to really fight the egg before the chicken dilemma So I can't answer that but if I am by some chance influencing them It's in the direction they wanted, like they're, they're usually like, Oh, great.
I never thought of that. Cool. Let's do it. Um, cause usually I'm very much reading in the positive, even when I see something that is maybe challenging, I will articulate it in a way that's most empowering, not in a way that disempowers you. Cause I don't see the point, right. And I'm sure that you do the same.
So to me, like when you say these are the tools that you use for more specific present now situations, they're very helpful. I think the one thing that, uh, about the Tarot, that's a bit more. I mean the, about the astrology that's a bit more like encompassing is that it's more talking about who you're being, who you are, as opposed to the cards we're telling you where you're at, right, in this moment.
So you can use it to identify who you are. I can see who you are by who you come up as and by my intuition, but it's, it's more about like what your circumstances are and what do you want to create. So to me, it's like, if you want facts in this moment, like, how do I move this moment tomorrow, the next day, the next week?
Perfect. But if I'm doing astrology, I like it for like, what do I, how do I move this year? Who am I in this life? Like it's broader. Yeah.
Cameron: I would agree. I would. The words that were coming to my mind is that the Tarot can be very powerful for helping you understand who you are being.
Noella: Yes.
Cameron: And the astrology can help you to understand who are, who you are becoming.
Noella: Oh, becoming
Cameron: one helps us in understanding being and the other ends helps us understanding who we're becoming
Noella: a hundred percent. I love the way that you put that. That's, that's well, it might be the title of the episode. I don't know. We'll
Cameron: see.
Noella: That's very, very beautifully articulated, actually.
Cameron: I really, I appreciate so much, too, what you're saying about, really, first of all, the role of a reader.
And then this, this idea, cause it's the same in astrology. It's like, are the planets making something happen to me in my life? Or is this happening first or whatever? The point is, well, first of all, there's an axiom in astrology as above, so below. So what's happening up there in the sky is really just a reflection of what's happening within us.
So I don't really care which is first or next. I also. I'm not all that concerned about where that's coming from if it's resonating. This is useful for you. If this is resonating with you, if this is helpful in your moment, because you're co creating with the universe as you always are, this is where the power of these tools really come into being.
Noella: Yes. Yeah. I think the other thing that, yes, I actually liked that when you said, when you said that, but as above, so below thing resonates for everything. Right. And I think that one thing that I noticed also is that I think this probably happens with you with a lot of the parts of, of you is that people think that you're reading the thing, right?
Like, and you are, you use them as sort of a basis or a foundation, but then after that, your, uh, intuition or however you want to put it, your insight is coming from a deeper place or. A connected place in my opinion, like I feel like it's coming more from source or from their higher self connecting to my higher self.
So I'm not just telling you what the pictures are. It's not like, Oh, this is a pretty picture of a guy giving flowers to the, no, like not at all. Some people read like that, I'm sure. But I think that the point is, is to take it and use it as sort of like, this is the, the math we're using to guide us. And then you're coming from a place for you as well, experience, insight, and then just what's coming through.
So when people also, because I'm sure people ask you, they always say, where, where, where is this information? Like, what are you connecting to? Like, what's the source? And I remember in the beginning, it used to really stump me because I didn't believe in anything for that period of time. And then I began, I was like, I don't know.
I don't, I don't know what I think about God anymore. So for a long time, I just say, I don't know. I just, I don't ask the questions. Like, as long as I know it's not like evil, I'm not, I don't care. But now I think it's coming from largely from you or from your higher self. Or from the universe, which we all are one.
So it doesn't really matter again, but I'm very careful now about like what I'm connecting to in the sense of like, I do know there's energetic, you know, sort of like a polarities out there. And also you can, you can very much mislead sometimes if you're not really connecting to something that rounds you.
So I'm a bit more particular now where before it was just more like sort of this fun, cool thing I could do. Now I really do take it a little bit more seriously that I'm really helping people guide and make big, major decisions. And I, and I want to make sure that it's authentic for them. It's not just what I'm reading,
Cameron: you know?
I would say this is something that resonates very deeply with me as well. Um, you know, I believe it, you're on a spiritual path and you're looking for assistance. You'll find the people that you resonate with. But some people ask things like, well, are they any good? Are they a good tarot reader? Are they a good astrologer?
And the truth is, A lot of these, they're tools, number one, how to use that neutral tools, how people use them, what their art is, what their own soul's gifts are. Their divine gifts are very different. So for me, I use astrology, obviously, I'm reading charts, I'm looking, it's a literal symbol with a line and a design, right, and a part of the chart, and it means something.
And you can read that in a Flat or two dimensional sense, there are plenty of astrologers who can read what the thing means, right? But when I'm looking at a chart, something else is coming alive and I'm very much connected to source every single time I do a reading. I'm always calling in the higher self of the person that I'm reading, of course.
But the symbols may, https: otter. ai
Noella: from your
Cameron: father's lineage and it affected you in this lifetime. Now, does the chart spell out emotional abuse from your father's lineage?
Noella: No, it doesn't say it
Cameron: could manifest in a myriad of ways, but when I allow myself to be open to the divine in my readings like this, I'll get that information and honestly, I stopped second guessing it, but at first it used to freak me out because I'm like, how am I going to say this thing to this person?
Are they going to freak down to me? Are they going to say, what the hell? You know? Because the chart doesn't, like, say that. It doesn't officially say that, so it's like Um, but anyway, this is where I would say the art and the gifts of the reader of the practitioner is a really big deal. And so, you know, if you're resonating with somebody, then great, but recognize that no, not everybody out there is actually skilled or gifted, they might know how to read, but they don't.
That doesn't mean, you know, they're spiritually adept. We'll put it that way.
Noella: That's right. And also sensitive to the fact that they are talking to somebody about things that matter to them, right? A lot of people are just like, no, I'm just reading the cards. And they say a lot of like sort of kitschy stuff that, you know, that readers say.
Um, and they're not really concerned with how this might affect somebody's choices and just how they feel. And so to me, it's, it's all of that. And I, I think that people tend to lose sight of that, especially, you know, when you're doing large groups like, you know, on TikTok or something crazy like that, which I, you know, I've never been a big fan of that.
Um, unless you're just literally just entertaining because people really take that stuff literally and they get confused and um, and I, and I think it's a little bit more serious than that. So also for me, I also, I don't know if you do this too, I'm sure you do, but I'm also concerned with who I am reading.
You know, I don't just read everybody. Um, I used to kind of, I used to think it was kind of interesting as like sort of training myself and it was like, I think I thought it was a little bit invincible, but you start to take on certain energies. Also, if you're not smart and you also, um, I don't want to tap into that.
I don't want to tap into things that I don't feel okay with, or that at least I know how to manage. And, um, so to me, it's, it's, it's, as you said, it's co creating, right? It's not just me telling you how it is. Um, we're never separate like that. We, we think we are, but we're not. Everything's so connected that it does matter to me.
And I think at the level you're, you're doing your work at, which is, you know, you're doing different things. You do, from what I know of UCAM, you do many different, some, some different modalities. And so I think you're, some of the things you do are quite deep. And so I, I'm sure for you, you're even more, um, selective about what you're choosing.
I don't think you're picking like, it's not like a, uh, uh, some kind of rating system or anything like that. It's not like the popular kids club. It's just, I do, I do like to get referrals and I, and I do ask clients, even if they get a, not, I just recently I've allowed people to just sign up on my website just recently because I felt like I'm capable now of doing that where I'm not afraid to do it.
I used to be completely referral only for most of my career. And so it's only in the last few years that I've opened it up like that, and it's because now I, I can sort it out, and I know very quickly, like, if somebody's just not, you're not there, you're not, you don't want to really hear, and I'm very clear on my website, and with just how I present, this is how I do it, so this might be too much for you, or not what you're looking for, and so I, it weeds out, and also I just think the universe attracts what, what works.
I don't think I have to do that much vetting. I've never had a problem, at least not recently, And maybe not ever where I've been like, Oh, that, that was just a role. I don't even know why that came into my office. You know, I've never really had that. I have had people that are very challenging and very confrontational, but that was when I was working at the store.
And so we just took whoever came in, you know, and that's what taught me. It taught me how to read people because I was reading just everybody. But it also taught me when to say no, because that for a long time, I didn't know how to just say, well, I don't think I'm the right person for you. You know, now I will, I'll say it right.
Cameron: I think there's an inter super powerful thing that you shared a few moments ago about entertainment. Like, I do not consider astrology to be entertaining for me. Do I enjoy it? Yes. Do I feel fulfilled when I do this work with people? Do I think it's a great gift? Absolutely. But I do get quite, admittedly, and I've not said this to my audience before, I get quite frustrated at the end.
When people are saying astrological things for entertainment purposes and my friends there are tons of people on Social media doing that there's dime a dozen. There's a reason why you don't hear me giving that stuff on social media ever If you read my accounts if you want to get an energetic rundown of the week You can sign up for my weekly email, which I send to
Noella: people But
Cameron: I don't find that astrology entertaining or fun.
And I think when people are in that space, it's dangerous actually, because it's extremely powerful and it's extremely, um, useful. And when we play in the realm of, Oh, this is fun and entertaining and whatever, then you're actually diminishing its power
Noella: because you're not realizing what you're dealing with.
Yeah. I think it's kind of like when people are out there, all these people on like witch talk, right? Like, uh, we're going to do our witchy little outfits and our little spells tonight. And we're going to manifest under the moon. It's like, do you know what, at all what you're doing? People are like sitting there telling you like, yeah, put a dollar bill under your door with cinnamon on it and do the, I'm like, first of all, The culture you're even getting that information for, um, where do they come from and what is their source and what are they trying to manifest in and what are their gods or what, what are they tapping into?
And this person over here that's using it, do they even know anything about that culture and why they were doing things that way? Will it work for them? Does it, should it work for them? There's just so many aspects to these things and people are just, like you said, it's entertainment and it's silly and it's funny and it's fun.
And then you'll, you know, if you're really into this stuff, you will, you can definitely hear stories where things went south. And I've definitely had clients come in, uh, very troubled about what they're experiencing because they've opened up certain doors. You know, I'm not deep into any of that for that reason.
So I don't have to think about it one way or the other. I'm not going to be casting any spells. You know, I don't know. I don't know what I think of all that. I have my opinions. I am from Africa. So there's a certain amount of just knowledge of what I think the power is. Um, but, uh, I would rather just not go there, you know what I mean?
And so to me, those people that are doing the witch talk thing or the astrology talk or, um, or even tarot talk, you know, when people are getting real crazy with it and saying, well, no, the tower means this. And this is the only thing it means. And, you know, you got the death card. Uh, oh, you know, whatever.
Like. You know, it's just, it's just, I just want to wipe my brow, you know what I mean? But it's, it's, it's also like, in a way, maybe ignorance is bliss to some degree, because then the, the certain kinds of people don't get that involved. They just let somebody tell them something, and they go do whatever.
But most people aren't even going to follow your advice. That's the, the fact of the matter. Not, not you, and with tarot readers, Um, I have, uh, a select group now that I, that I do more coaching with. So it's like we do the tarot card as a base to sort of understand who you are, kind of like you do with astrology.
And then from then on, we do the cards, but not often. Like it's not, you shouldn't do them often. Like you've already gotten the groundwork. You know what's coming. So how do we work ourselves to that place? And what did we not like about the reading? What can we adjust? It's very powerful in that way. And that's the way I prefer to use it.
But most people that are coming, let's be real. They just want to know, tell me what's up. And can I do this? Will this deal fall through? Will it not? I have no problem with that, but it is, um, It is what's gonna cause me eventually to move away from it. Because I do think it's very limiting and I, I think that you can only go so far with it.
Right. And, and I've adjusted on what I do very many times, like from being like, just like, Oh, let's, let's just get you out there to now where it's like, let's, let's change your life to eventually it will be like, let me find a way to really, uh, interact with this modality in a way that's really much more empowering to the individual.
And that frees me too, because I, you don't, you're not free in a way like your clients really. Um, they really rely on you as a tarot card reader, like very much. And I'm not good with that. Like, I, it's not something I encourage. I love that you trust me, but please do not rely on me. Right? Like it's, it's not my job to be in that position and it's a weight.
I used to think I liked, I think I liked it a lot, made me feel very important. And I used to like to feel like I'm, I'm really helping a lot of people. I just felt like really this responsibility. Now I can see where it can hold you back too. So.
Cameron: I think that's a really beautiful, I don't want to step over this because it's a beautiful comment about the hero's journey, but also just about a spiritual awakening in general.
For a lot of people, you know, we have a spiritual awakening, maybe it's a teacher or a yoga teacher or a shaman or a tarot card reader or whoever is particularly important in our path. And so, and it can be so disorienting when we go through awakenings. It's like, oh my god, I need help or whatever. And yet, The journey of a spiritual awakening ultimately will lead you to self reliance and self suffi or should lead you to self sufficiency, self reliance.
Um, I will share this. I did pull some cards from myself last night though. Yeah! I had a number of them in succession, but I only remember the first three. So, the
Noella: Fool,
Cameron: Eight of Swords, Two of Cups.
Noella: King of Swords?
Cameron: Eight of Swords and the Two of Cups.
Noella: What were you asking?
Cameron: Um, actually about my love life.
Noella: And what was the outcome card?
Cameron: Well, so I had a number of others that followed. I just kind of, I read like a story. What was
Noella: the number of others that followed? The third card again.
Cameron: Uh, Two of Cups.
Noella: Great. Wonderful. Have a good reading. That was a great reading. It's telling us where you started. Um, and what you want. The Fool, I love, because that's my favorite card, just by, just so you know.
Um, it's a very free energy. You've just, you actually are that in this time in your life, based on, you know, just your journey that you've come to LA. You're doing these new things. You're really expanding now. You've been very bold about it. You've been very brave about it, almost, almost foolhardy to some, right?
And that is, and you're like that about love, too. You've been very much, you've released stuff, let it go, you're moving on, you're trusting, and it was growing great, aid of sorts. That's where you are today. Oh god, I gotta release this stuff. And oh my god, these things came up. I didn't even know they were there I thought I was ready for a relationship.
I'm feeling a little bit like, uh, like i'm contracted right now Also, like maybe i'm good by myself Maybe I don't need to bring all that craziness into my life All the old fears come up and also now you're different than you were before before you did need it Or you thought you did now you really know I don't so now if I do it, they better be freaking awesome So I have not met that yet.
Awesome. Awesome person that i'd be willing You To expand for and willing to like give them my space and I don't know, you know I don't know and then that outcome card is brilliant because Of sorts and so that means you will let all that go two of cups is always about union So you're about to meet someone pretty soon Yeah, I know.
I know! The way you said that!
Cameron: Means I'm in the aid of swords! You're
Noella: the lord of the blade of swords, baby!
Cameron: That's what that means, y'all.
Noella: Baby.
Cameron: He's out there somewhere.
Noella: I mean, I'm just telling you, Cam, like, it's a little sooner than what you want, okay?
Cameron: It's sooner. Okay,
Noella: not long. It's not long. Like it's gonna be a bit more like surprising like oh crap like it's here Oh, well, I haven't done this this and this yet.
Like can we just like wait for a minute? Cuz I'm not quite ready I'm gonna be convenient. I'm so sorry But you will be very happy. I think
Cameron: Well, beautiful Well, I'm curious. Uh, thank you for that and the perspective on that. Also, I love that in this recording, we have now given people a taste of what these readings can be like.
So how cool is that? If you're enjoying the podcast and want even more support on your path, I invite you to check out the no cost path and purpose community complete with resources, tools, and special events, including beyond the show segments. The community is perfect for anyone seeking to live in greater alignment with their purpose.
Just head over to your path and purpose.com/community to join for free today.
But I'm curious, do you think that you've discovered your soul's purpose?
Noella: Yeah. Are you asking ? Yeah. . Yes, I have. Yes, I have. Um, it is to teach, it is, it is to bring light it, I mean, on a, in a bigger, broader way. It's just to bring light, it's to shine light on things. Especially about the individual to shine light on who you are and who you're being and what you can be.
But it's to shine light on the world. It's to shine light, um, cause there's a lot of dark. And it's to radiate that. And to make people feel hope. To allow people to, not make people feel hope, to give people a sense of hope. To give people, hopefully, an example of this is how you can feel. Um, my big thing is learning how to play with life and learning, um, how, how, uh, beautiful you are, how unconditionally you can love yourself.
So to me, uh, self love is the inherent, the biggest message I have. You must learn to love yourself unconditionally, really, and then everything else flows. That to me by itself is generating light. Um, so be when I say is to shine light is to be a light. Okay, so that is my purpose. And, um, so whenever things are dark or whenever people are talking about, like, why aren't you more realistic about what you're posting?
Like, it's some serious stuff going on. Haven't you commented on this war? Why haven't you commented on politics? That's not my purpose. I'm not ignoring it. I'm very aware it's there. I don't hide from it. And there are times when I will talk about it, but it's not my purpose to reveal more than that. I'm not that person that's bringing up all the dark at all.
You are very aware of it. We're more than aware of it. We're immersed in it. So my job is in the midst of that to show you the light. And that's my purpose.
Cameron: Beautiful. Uh, what do you think it means? Maybe you kind of said it, but what do you think it means to live with purpose?
Noella: To me, it's, it's, it's a little different than the way we were taught.
I think people used to think of it as like, well, what are you going to achieve in this lifestyle, that time? You know, like, what's your, what's your, what are you going to leave for everyone to remember you by? And I don't think that is it at all. I think it is not about that. I think purpose is about being able to be with you.
Who am I? Truly is to discover. I think everyone's purpose is to discover what and who they are and to be as authentic as they can be within that knowing. And then everything else unfolds because if we were all doing it and not so worried about what Joe, Jack and Joe are doing over there, we would be glowing.
We would just be being so I think purpose to me is discovering what it is that you as a soul came to this earth to explore. That was either explored, unexplored in the past life, or you didn't complete, um, uh, complete, uh, releasing or whatever, you know, what are we supposed to heal, what we're supposed to learn, what you're supposed to release that you haven't, that to me is what you can call your purpose, I, I would call it more a calling than a purpose, or more of a, of your journey, and that's why I, I like to call everything a journey, because it's not, to me, it's not so much purpose as journey.
Where am I? I had it this year, you know, where am I headed time instead of what am I going to accomplish? Because purpose tends to make people think of achievement or accomplishment when I think it's more about the knowing of why you get up every day.
Cameron: Yeah. And I talk about this all the time that really the path to living your purpose is what it's all about.
Absolutely. For change and shift.
Noella: Literally. And I never used to get that for the longest time. It was like this whole thing. I remember when people used to talk. Talking about like, it's not about the destination. I was like, yes, it is not about that. Then why am I going to the gym every day? Like, it was just like, no.
And then I remember one point realizing, like, I remember after I got like really fit at one point realizing, like, I didn't remember so much of it. Like, and then just like, I mean, it was cool that I got there. I was like, wow. But then when I tried to do it again, I couldn't repeat it because I wasn't in that place anymore.
And I didn't want to do the things. So I didn't have the incentive because I never grounded it into who I am. Because I was too busy getting there. I didn't care about how I got there now. It's like well, I wasn't eating right I wasn't so many things I didn't do the way you could cuz I was so much in a hurry I got there, but it wasn't about the destination And in fact as I did it as I got there, it was like I got so happy I knew made new friends.
I became part of a new community. It just became a different life But I, it, it took me being, you know, in retrospect to see that meanwhile, I could have been experiencing that and just enjoying like, Oh my God, this is so fun. This is so interesting. Look at all these people. I'm meeting these things I'm learning.
And so I've really changed that now. That's a really good point. Yeah.
Cameron: Well, thank you so much, Noella, for your time today. This conversation was amazing. I'm so happy to have you on the show and to be part of season two. In our new format. And, um, for any of you who would like to connect with Noella, you can find all of her information in the show.
Noella: Thank you. Thank you, Cam. Thanks for having me. It's been such a pleasure. I'm still getting to know you. So this is brilliant. You're so welcome. So thank you so much. You're welcome.
Cameron: A heartfelt thanks to you for tuning into this episode. I'm Dr. Cameron Martin, and it's been an honor to support you on your path to self discovery.
As you reflect on today's conversation, remember that the journey toward living and leading from your soul's purpose is ongoing. You're never alone in it.
Until next time.